Is it a coincidence that the two best hitters in baseball history had a pitching background?
IMO, no.

What makes you think Teddy had a "pitching background"? IIRC, he was obsessive in his teens as a hitter, and only took the mound for all of two innings at the end of one blowout game in 1940. Not at all the same animal as Ruth.

Um, thanman, I believe 4th was talking about Ted and Canseco, not Ruth.

ROFL. But seriously, although Teddy didn't really do much pitching in the majors, I believe he pitched quite a bit before the majors. So it's fair to say he had a "pitching background", but obviously not the same as Ruth's.

The last mention at www.tedwilliams.com of Ted pitching was his senior year of high school, and most MLB players pitch at that level as all it takes to succeed is a live arm. Color me skeptical...

i don't believe he has a pitching background because as an all conference first basemen i pitched some, that means anyone can. cool picture though, one i have never seen before.

He pitched in high school but his picture is more than ten years after his debut.

Stan Musial began his minor-league career as a pitcher, but came down with a sore arm.

No, dude, the picture is from August of 1940.

As far as I can recall, he had some kind of pre-major-league background in pitching, i.e., more than just a couple of novelty innings.

Of course, nothing like Ruth, but Ruth was a HOF-level pitcher, so...

I wonder how many of the great hitters had pitching backgrounds.
C Otto mentioned Musial...

It just seems intuitive that learning how to pitch would give hitters a better understanding of how certain pitches break, what goes through a pitcher's mind, how to use the body for maximum torque, etc.

It's a cool photo, but almost any good baseball player pitches at some early point in their career. Little league, Babe Ruth, High School. The best players generally play the important postions coming up, SS & P (at least in youth leagues).

I had thought the story about Ted Williams's pitching appearance was well-known to Red Sox fans, but for those who are unaware of the events here is the gist of what transpired.

The Detroit Tigers came to town on August 24, 1940, for four games in two days. They were in second-place, trailing the Indians by four games and leading the fourth-place Boston Red Soxby three-and-a-half. The Williams was brought in to pitch the final two innings, trailing 11-1. He faced nine batters, allowing three hits and one run and striking out Rudy York on three pitches. The run scored when Boston's third baseman bobbled a double play ball in the ninth. Pitcher Jim Bagby, taking over for Williams in left, made his only appearance as an outfielder in the major leagues, and the catcher was Joe Glenn, who also caught Babe Ruth when he made his last pitching appearance in 1933.

The two clubs split the two double headers with the Tigers pulling to within two-and-a-half games of the Indians and the Red Sox moving to within six-and-a-half. Detroit went on to win the pennant while the Red Sox tied with the White Sox for fourth-place.

If I remember the story correctly, Williams had been pestering the manager for the chance to pitch for some time, saying how great he was in high school, etc. The manager finally said OK, more to shut him up than anything else. Ted went in, pitched OK and never asked to pitch again.

Well, pitching in little league or Babe Ruth is a far cry from pitching in high school.
A high school pitcher develops a more mature mindset and set of mechanics.
If Ted pitched in high school, that would jibe with my hunch.
But seriously, who HASN'T pitched in LL or Babe Ruth?



As for "any good baseball player" pitching at some point in high school, college, or the minors, I don't know about that. I'd love to see a thorough list. Anyone know how to find/compile one?

And thank you C_Otto for the info.

His ERA was 4.50, versus a league ERA of 4.51!

Jimmie Foxx pitched a scoreless in relief for the Red Sox during the 1939 season, striking out one of the three batters he faced. There's a story that when Williams was first coming to the Red Sox, someone remarked to him, "Wait until you see Foxx hit." Williams allegedly replied, "Wait until Foxx sees me hit." It's possible this rivalry carried over.

BTW, Foxx made nine other mound appearances, including two starts, when he played for the Phillies in 1945. Overall, he was 1-0 with a 1.59 ERA in the 23.2 innings he pitched in his career. He only gave up 13 hits but walked 14 and hit a batter, while striking out 11.

OK, Babe Ruth, Ted Williams, Jimmie Foxx...

Three of the greatest hitters of all time.

Can someone put my hunch/theory out of its misery by listing a bunch of mediocre hitters who pitched in highschool or after?

David McCarty.

Hah! That's a good start.

Hmm... does Livan Hernandez count?

OK, how about:

How many of the best hitters ever had a high school or better pitching background?

Six.

But seriously, if you're so darned interested in this postulate, why don't YOU go research it and post the answer here? Hmmmmmmmmm?

Cuz I'm LAAAAAAAAZZZZZZZZZZZYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY.

I love how the Sox uniform has basically stayed unchanged since way back when.

I miss the D-Rays rainbow jerseys.

4B, FWIW I just picked up my old copy of My Turn At Bat (Fireside Book published by Simon and Shuster, first Fireside edition, 1988), and was looking through the photos of him on page 94 and there is one from the Author's collection of him pitching in High School, with Ted's caption saying, "San Diego was a ballplayer's town, year round, and by the time I was a pitcher at Herbet Hoover High I was hooked," which infers he started out pitching.

You missed the 1970's my friend.

Babe Ruth started as a pitcher, did he not?

Wow, thanks W.A.C.!

So that would be something, wouldn't it?
If both the Babe and Ted Williams started out as pitchers?

What Williams says on page 20 of that book is:

I pitched when I was a kid because there was more action there and I played first base and the outfield.

Later on (pp39-40) he describes the beginning of his minor-league career with the San Diego Padres in the Pacific Coast League:

[After travelling with the team a while] Eventually, Shellenback let me get up as a pinch hitter and I took three strikes, right down the middle, petrified. After that I pitched batting practice until one Saturday night we got 10 runs behind in the sixth inning of a game with the Angels at Wrigley Field in Los Angeles. With a doubleheader coming up on Sunday, Shellenback was desperate for a pitcher. Eddie Mulligan was one of our coaches and I heard Shellenback say to Mulligan, "Damn it, Eddie, who am I going to put in there? I'm using up all my pitchers." When he went out to the coaching line I moved in beside Mulligan . "Tell him to put me in, Eddie. I can pitch. I'm ready." Mulligan looked at me, then smiled, and when Shellenback came in he suggested it. Shellenback nodded and told me to go down and warm up. He didn't have much choice actually.

So I warmed up, then he let me pinch hit. Boom, a double. A rally starts and by the time the inning is over, we've got five runs. So I go out and hold them an inning, and then I get to bat again. Boom, another double. Now, we've whittled it down to 11 to 12, something like that, and Shellenback's got a good relief pitcher working in the bullpen. I go out to pitch again, and the first four guys in the next inning score runs. Shellenback's out there like a flash to pull me out, and the way he tells it I kind of shrugged and said, "Skip, I think you've got me laying the wrong position." He put me in left field for the rest of the game and I was there for the rest of the year.