A weird thing just happened...

I received an email from someone who works in the Rangers office (long story, not related to baseball in any way) but I emailed him back to see if he could tell me anything and he basically said that everyone down there was going crazy, it is all up to the union and he expected an announcement would be made around 5.

Yeah, I know this is nothing new but it should be coming to a head soon.

This just ran on the AP wire:

Trade talks stretch past deadline|
|By RONALD BLUM|
|AP Sports Writer|
NEW YORK (AP) — Alex Rodriguez’s agent and the Boston Red Sox negotiated Thursday in an attempt to restructure his $252 million contract so it would gain approval from the players’ union.
Talks were ongoing at 5 p.m., the deadline set by commissioner Bud Selig for an agreement on reworking the shortstop’s record deal, a step necessary before Texas could trade him to Boston for Manny Ramirez.
‘‘I’m still in the middle of it,’’ Scott Boras, the AL MVP’s agent, said just after 5 p.m.
Rodriguez and the Red Sox reached a deal Wednesday, but that was rejected by the union, which said it reduced the value of the contract.
While management’s top labor lawyer hinted Wednesday that commissioner Bud Selig might approve the rejected deal, Rodriguez made clear Thursday morning that he would go to Boston only with an agreement that met the union’s approval.
Because Rodriguez has a no-trade clause, a trade can’t happen without his approval.
‘‘In the spirit of cooperation, I advised the Red Sox I am willing to restructure my contract, but only within the guidelines prescribed by union officials,’’ Rodriguez said in a statement he read to The Associated Press. ‘‘I recognize the principle involved, and fully support the need to protect the interests of my fellow players.
‘‘If my transfer to the Red Sox is to occur, it must be done with consideration of the interests of all major league players, not just one. Any statements by club officials suggesting my position is different than stated is inaccurate and unfortunate.’’
His agent said it was up to the Red Sox to find a way to restructure Rodriguez’s contract without reducing its value.
‘‘It’s in the teams’ hands,’’ Boras said Thursday morning. ‘‘Unless Boston comes back with a proposal that meets the union’s criteria, then the deal will not get done.’’
Wednesday’s talks were held in New York, but Thursday’s negotiations were done by telephone. Union official Gene Orza and management lawyer Rob Manfred traveled to Florida for Bubba Trammell’s grievance hearing Thursday.
If the blockbuster deal does go through, Boston probably would trade longtime shortstop Nomar Garciaparra, possibly to the Chicago White Sox.

According to Gammons on ESPNnews, the deadline passed and they are DONE -- the deal is dead.

But then he said they could go back in the next few days...

...And then he said that he really just doesn't know.


So, typical Gammo.

Gasbag on ESPN News - "Breaking News: yeah right,


the big news was that he knows nothing but that the deal is not done because the deadline has passed.... But he doesn't know what's going on behind the scenes....

My best guess is the Sox got all the money out of Hicks they could and went back to the Union with a final offer, which will probably get it done. But it's all speculation at this point.

Not true. He said it didn't get done, but it still could, and basically that he has no idea what's going on. He did NOT say that it's dead.

Stop assuming...please...gasbag is clueless like us right now...

Supposedly they blinked and said "you can't take 30 mil off the deal, but you can take 15 mil off"

SPORTS UPDATE: The Boston Globe has learned that although the 5 p.m. deadline for reaching an agreement in the trade of Manny Ramirez and Alex Rodriguez has passed, talks involving the Red Sox and Rangers are continuing. -- Developing

Not much new news, but thought I'd pass this on. Was just posted on boston.com

SPORTS UPDATE: The Boston Globe has learned that although the 5 p.m. deadline for reaching an agreement in the trade of Manny Ramirez and Alex Rodriguez has passed, talks involving the Red Sox and Rangers are continuing. -- Developing

i have no doubt that selig will bend the rules if necessary regarding the deadline, since both sides seem to be heading toward a compromise. the other option is that boston and texas make the deal without changing ARod's contract dramatically. this deal will get done. they wouldn't still be working on it if the deadline was a REAL deadline.

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Gasbag just reported the deal did not happen by the deadline.

Sorry, with so many people on the board my browser is not refreshing and updating new posts until after I posted this.

If a) Hicks dropped the additional cash request, and B) the union will allow ANY relief whatsoever, do the deal. Now. Don't make us suffer any longer... *dies*

espn radio now saying that Selig has ended talks

Just ran on the AP Wire:

NEW YORK (AP) — Baseball commissioner Bud Selig ends talks between Alex Rodriguez and Boston, dealing another setback to proposed trade with Texas.

When posting the same info you are pounding the server which hosts this web site causing it to run slowly.

I agree that Chan Ho Park's contract is as much, if not more of a hinderance to Texas' rebuilding than A-Rod's contract.

But I completely disagree that the Red Sox bear any responsibility, financial or otherwise, for correcting Hicks' mistakes.

That's the point I made in an earlier post here.

The deadline is not for the trade--it's for talking to ARod about restructuring.
There is no deadline to do the deal--except the one imposed by Hicks.
They've talked enough to ARod.
In fact, they should have never gone to the Players Union--in my view.
They should have made the deal--and then quietly restructured during the winter.
JH didn't do this thing right.

If Selig really did put an end to the talks, that's a bunch of crap. The Sox and Rangers should be able to communicate freely if they so wish, regardless of restructuring deadlines...

I'm hoping that the Sox just played an excellent game of chicken and left Hicks sitting in a ditch. I'm convinced they played the union's rejection of the initial offer and their approval of wiggling out of $15 million against Hicks monetary demands and he folded a little and that we'll (crossing fingers) see some movement before the evening is out.

What does that mean??

One of the local sports station was saying that Selig's comments mean that a restructuring of Arods contract cannot be discussed any longer. But the sox/rangers can still accept the trade....but Arod deal cannot be restructured any longer.

Well it doesnt look good.

It means that the talk of restructure is over...not the trade discussions.

It means-- "Please disperse, there is nothing to see here."

That's the point I made in an earlier post here.

The deadline is not for the trade--it's for talking to ARod about restructuring.
There is no deadline to do the deal--except the one imposed by Hicks.
They've talked enough to ARod.
In fact, they should have never gone to the Players Union--in my view.
They should have made the deal--and then quietly restructured during the winter.
JH didn't do this thing right.

I dont think they neewd to restructure anymore- if hicks has backed down to the extent that people have said he has, and the original union proposal is still there, it matches, more or less, and then whats the problem?

So then if the union's final offer was $15 millm they shouldn't need to keep talking about the restructure, since Hicks is offering to come down on his demand also. this may not be a bad thing. Right?

From Rotoworld:

The 5 p.m. ET deadline passed without Alex Rodriguez being traded to Boston.
The passing of the deadline doesn't mean that the deal is off, but it would seem to suggest that nothing will happen tonight.

5 EST, sorry but I should have been more clear about that. Damn time zones.

Can you picture AROD in a Sox uniform? Trust me in a few years you.ll regret it if we get him. He doesn't belong in a RedSox jersey. Nomar is old-school, it's time to mend fences. He belongs with the sox. ARod will become another Griffey JR. Sure it's great to have a HOF on the team, but he will get hurt sooner or later, and they'll be eating that contract.

The Sox can't deal directly with A-Rod, they can still work a deal with Texas on a trade. My understanding is that they can work Hicks down to a $$ that lets them make the trade, is within PA guidlines and satisfies JH. As the real BOSS (BS) says "Faith will be rewarded" and I don't mean SiaS!

And Nomar won't?

In fact, Nomar already has...

Hytem- I'd love to agree with you, but JH is not taking a flyer.......he wouldn't go into a deal with A-Rod without knowing for certain how much he's going to cost. This is not your Dan Duquette Red Sox-- these fellas got a plan.

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switching to paper cups instead of glass guys

No no no no no no. This means A-Rod can not _talk_ directly with the Red Sox about restructuring his contract any longer. HOWEVER, there is nothing to say that Scott Boras and Alex Rodriguez along with their lawyers can not restructure the contract based on things that JWH, and Theo have already talked to him about. Selig doesn't have the right to ban a player from restructuring his contract

Exactly.

But not only is Nomar the second best shortstop in the majors right now, only behind ARod, he's probably one of the ten best shortstops of all-time. It just so happens that four of them are playing right now (ARod, Nomar, Tejada and Jeter) so it seems as if big, rangy, athletic shortstops who can adequately field this toughest of defensive positions as well as hit like a corner outfielder are the norm. Actually, in the history of the game, they're extremely rare. And this is what makes each of the the four of them extremely valuable. Before Cal Ripken broke the mold, shortstop was solely a defensive position. There used to be a world where a Mark Belanger was highly valued. No more.

And I still say that Nomar Garciaparra is the best shortstop in the history of baseball at going deep into the hole at short and throwing out runners. He's got the best arm I've ever seen and he has completely mastered that most difficult of plays.

I've loved watching him play (I always sit as close to first base as I can when I come to Fenway because I love to watch infielders work) since he came up and I'm really going to miss him if he's gone in 2004, even if the great ARod replaces him.

Can't Boston complete the deal, and then sign ARod to a two year extension on his deal? For example, couldn't they tack on two years at 500K each, bringing down the luxury tax number from 25.2 million to ~21 million?

I usually get no sleep during the Hot Stove season, but this is just getting ridiculous.

Would you care to provide some reasons why A-Rod doesn't "belong" in a Red Sox uniform. Also, why exactly is Nomar "old school"? I'm genuinely interested...

yeah, since everybodyhas made some compromises, this will get done. enough progress happened before the deadline that now it's just a matter of the sox and rangers dotting the i's. there's no deadline for that unless Hicks makes one (which he won't, since he needs this deal to happen.)

From redsox.com


Selig announced right after the deadline that no agreement was reached. The trade can still be made, but the window for negotiating with Rodriguez has closed.


So it would seem it's not over as others have stated.

URGENT|
Selig stops A-Rod talks|
Eds: UPDATES throughout with detail, quotes. Will be led.|
More from the AP wire

|By RONALD BLUM|
|AP Sports Writer|
NEW YORK (AP) — Baseball commissioner Bud Selig ended talks between Alex Rodriguez and Boston to restructure the shortstop’s $252 million contract, dealing another setback to the proposed trade between the Red Sox and Texas.
The sides were trying to rework the shortstop’s deal Thursday afternoon in a manner acceptable to the Red Sox and the players’ association when Selig stopped talks about 20 minutes after the 5 p.m. deadline.
‘‘Due to the unique and complex nature of the negotiations surrounding the proposed transaction involving Alex Rodriguez and Manny Ramirez and the number of teams involved, the negotiations did not reach a successful conclusion by the deadline set,’’ Selig said in a statement. ‘‘I have terminated my permission for Boston and Alex Rodriguez to continue pursuing this transaction at this time.’’
Rodriguez and the Red Sox reached an agreement Wednesday, but that was rejected by the union, which said it reduced the value of the contract, the highest in professional sports history. Boston and Texas said they had a trade in place.
There was no immediate reaction from the Red Sox and Rangers, and it was unclear if talks could resume later.

This was added a few minutes ago. This story will probably stand until the teams comment:

‘‘It’s unfortunate that the players’ association felt it necessary to take a legal position which prevented the player and at least two teams from effectuating an agreement that they felt was beneficial,’’ said Bob DuPuy, baseball’s chief operating officer.
While management’s top labor lawyer hinted Wednesday that Selig might approve the rejected deal, Rodriguez made clear Thursday morning that he would go to Boston only with an agreement that met the union’s approval.
Because Rodriguez has a no-trade clause, a trade can’t happen without his approval.
‘‘In the spirit of cooperation, I advised the Red Sox I am willing to restructure my contract, but only within the guidelines prescribed by union officials,’’ Rodriguez said in a statement he read to The Associated Press. ‘‘I recognize the principle involved, and fully support the need to protect the interests of my fellow players.
‘‘If my transfer to the Red Sox is to occur, it must be done with consideration of the interests of all major league players, not just one. Any statement by club officials suggesting my position is different than stated is inaccurate and unfortunate.’’
His agent had said it was up to the Red Sox to find a way to restructure Rodriguez’s contract without reducing its value.
‘‘It’s in the teams’ hands,’’ Scott Boras had said Thursday morning. ‘‘Unless Boston comes back with a proposal that meets the union’s criteria, then the deal will not get done.’’
Wednesday’s talks were held in New York, but Thursday’s negotiations were done by telephone. Union official Gene Orza and management lawyer Rob Manfred traveled to Florida for Bubba Trammell’s grievance hearing Thursday.
If the blockbuster deal had gone through this week, Boston probably would have traded longtime shortstop Nomar Garciaparra, possibly to the Chicago White Sox.

How about this talk of Clemens talking with Hicks about joining the Rangers? That's all we need is Roger's big snout in all of this mess. I could see him with his HMO highlights telling Hicks to go buck wild and keep A-Rod.

But if Hicks is serious about bringing Roger, then he's gotta clear out A-Rod.

Selig ending talks has ended something that was all ready over. JWH and Theo had allready talked with AROD and then took it to Orza and the players union the union gave them their willingness so that was set NO more dealing with AROD he is out of the deal now he is willing to except the trade to boston and that is all we need now it is just between Hicks and the RedSox.

..talks with ARod ended....
not talks between the two teams.
lots of misinformation being spread around....

The one thing that gives me reason to be optimistic is that according to ESPN Rangers are among the teams pursuing Ponson. If the Rangers have, in fact, contacted Ponson's agent about acquiring him, that would suggest that the Rangers expect this deal to be done. I can't imagine them throwing that all away now. They need and want this. Hicks has gone on record as saying Manny is the best hitter in baseball. Have some faith.

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Long time stalker at SoSh, shut out like all the rest. Looks like MLPBA not only people who won't let you go where you want. Does anybody really think we'll find out the whole truth once this is over? Don't subsidize Hicks, ridding him of Arod's salary should be enough. Now he can do even more Chan Ho Park deals.

I think a big part of the Red Sox's substantially increased popularity over the last few years is due to having not only two great players in Nomar Garciaparra and Pedro Martinez, but also to the duo being the two most exciting players to watch in all of baseball. This may be a subjective judgement, but I believe it to be a sound one.

I understand everyone's frustration. When John Henry said this transcends baseball, he was not speaking out of his a**. A-Rod is wealthy enough not to need protection anymore, but the bargaining agreement is written as it is to protect the players from modifying their contracts because they are under duress. In essence, it protects the little people, eg the Shea HIllenbrand types of the basball world.

What I don't agree with is the concept of "value" being only money. In A-Rod's case, the exchange of value for him may be as simple as being on a team that contends, or living near his wife's family. To simplify "value" to be just monetary fails to recognize that players are human beings and not just commodities. In short, while ther should be an objective standard, there should also be a subjective component...that can come only from the player himself. It sounds like A-Rod has stated his case.......the MLPA should listen.