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Full Version: Going too far
Edmund Dantes
Jun 24 2005, 05:10 PM
http://keyboardbaseball.blogspot.com/2005/...-dirt-dogs.html QUOTE That's an image of a white mob in Civil Rights-era south kicking in the face of a black man- an image used to convey a joke about a baseball manager returning to his old town.
I really think everyone who reads this should write to the Boston Globe and Boston.com in an effort to let them know how ****ing embarassing it is for their company to have him associated with them. He's a scumbag, and this isn't proof- it's further and strong, strong proof. This sort of thing isn't cutting it anymore, either.
All this below a little banner telling us we should vote hard for Johnny, because it's "the right thing to do." Considering his site is named after his little nickname for all the "gritty white guys," I don't know why this should surprise me, but what makes me laugh is to think of the furor over Barry Bonds' statements last year about Boston- about how it is still, in many ways, a racist town- and how much hand wringing that got. And here's the number one fan site- purchased by boston.com- with consistent content like this. Whatever. Bullshit Memorials take on this, and I agree.
MEY126
Jun 24 2005, 05:22 PM
Silva's site used to be good for a laugh, but is basically unreadable lately. This is a new low. I hope he gets so heavily censored by boston.com that his site fades into complete irrelvance.
Pede
Jun 24 2005, 05:23 PM
I absolutely agree. I was shocked when I saw that image on my visit today, my first visit to the site in weeks and weeks.
It is one thing for Silva to get away with bashing Sox players, former players, etc. But, the arena that this move has entered him into is vile and embarassing to people associated with Boston.
The fact that The Globe and Boston.com continue to let this ass-clown drag names through the mud and make some tasteless jokes may have finally caught up with them.
Pede
Jun 24 2005, 05:25 PM
The image is no longer on the site, even though the Francona topic is still at the top of the page. This has replaced the above mentioned image:
mclusky
Jun 24 2005, 05:37 PM
It's amazing how quickly people who swear they never read the site pick up on what's happening there.
Edmund Dantes
Jun 24 2005, 05:46 PM
I don't read the site. Notice the source, but nice try.
NU five oh
Jun 24 2005, 05:52 PM
teddykgb
Jun 24 2005, 06:12 PM
to be fair, i went to the site once this afternoon and wasn't offended in the least, as I didn't really know what the picture was of or about. While there are few who would give DD the benefit of the doubt, and perhaps rightfully so, it remains possible that he just didn't know what he had put up there, which strikes me as possible.
kiransdad
Jun 24 2005, 06:13 PM
That's pretty f&@$ed up. That's all I have to say about that...
rominer
Jun 24 2005, 06:18 PM
Given news events this week, I find it hard to imagine that one could be oblivious to the image being used.
And I'm not easy to offend.
I get the joke, though. I have no problem with the joke. Just with the image used to convey that joke.
I don't know the whole personal history between BDD and RSN, so I'm less inclined to be anti-BDD than some here I guess. But this one definitely crossed the line.
teddykgb
Jun 24 2005, 06:21 PM
QUOTE(rominer @ Jun 24 2005, 07:17 PM) Given news events this week, I find it hard to imagine that one could be oblivious to the image being used.
[right][snapback]337983[/snapback][/right]
What news events are you talking about? And I really think you're giving an awful lot of credit to a guy who basically clawed his way to having a tiny morsel of relevance by making his life the boston red sox to think he'd be entirely "in the know" when it comes to world events. Frankly, I'd be surprised if the guy knew who lost the last presidential election.
NU five oh
Jun 24 2005, 06:32 PM
QUOTE(teddykgb @ Jun 24 2005, 07:20 PM) What news events are you talking about? And I really think you're giving an awful lot of credit to a guy who basically clawed his way to having a tiny morsel of relevance by making his life the boston red sox to think he'd be entirely "in the know" when it comes to world events. Frankly, I'd be surprised if the guy knew who lost the last presidential election. [right][snapback]337984[/snapback][/right]
Congress has been talking about "anti-lynching" laws all week. I believe they issued a formal apology for not addressing the problem much sooner. Even without the recent current event attention, the image is in pretty poor taste.
MargoAdamsLoveChild
Jun 24 2005, 06:34 PM
QUOTE(NU five oh @ Jun 24 2005, 07:31 PM) Congress has been talking about "anti-lynching" laws all week. I believe they issued a formal apology for not addressing the problem much sooner. Even without the recent current event attention, the image is in pretty poor taste. [right][snapback]337990[/snapback][/right]
Also, the trial of the 80-year-old former Klansman who was convicted and sentenced to 60 years in prison for the murder of three civil rights workers in the 1960s was in the headlines the past 2 weeks.
PSF
Jun 24 2005, 07:01 PM
Someone at boston.com noticed: QUOTE Note to users: Earlier today, Boston Dirt Dogs used a photo on this page that was offensive and inappropriate. There was no malicious intent behind the posting. We removed the photo immediately, and we apologize to any users who saw it during the brief time it was on the site.
beatlesfab4fan
Jun 24 2005, 07:33 PM
While Silva may have intended the photo as a "joke",I am sure that people who actually had that kind of thing done to them during the civil rights movement would not find it in the least bit "funny"... Once again Silva has shown a penchant for insensitivity and poor taste.... Just my .02 Mike
chrisgeleven
Jun 24 2005, 09:04 PM
QUOTE(PSF @ Jun 24 2005, 08:00 PM) Someone at boston.com noticed: [right][snapback]338002[/snapback][/right]
No malicious intent my a$$. I'm not stupid. It is clear what is going on in that picture and it is clear what era that is from without actually having to read an explanation. Simply. AWFUL. I can't believe the Boston Globe.
RedSoxAnni
Jun 24 2005, 09:05 PM
Steve Silva must have the negatives from the last Globe editors' booze cruise!
BoSoxGirl75
Jun 24 2005, 09:16 PM
I used to think that DD's site was a bunch of laughs. Eventually it just became old (not funny, stupid, agenda driven,etc). There was a point when he would actually have some 'inside info'. Ok he got a few things right, of course he got a few things wrong too. Regardless, posting that picture....well it was just stupid. Real stupid.
MBed
Jun 24 2005, 09:26 PM
So basically he has moved a despicable image of racism and replaced it with a picture from a melee which cost the life of a Philadelphia police officer earlier this week. Nice.
What say the Globe about the trivial use of this photo?
Fiskian Pole Shot
Jun 24 2005, 09:36 PM
What else do you expect from a pig but a grunt?
Tek123
Jun 24 2005, 09:38 PM
I don't think the nickname "Dirt Dogs" was originated by him. If I recall, it was Trot Nixon, Brian Daubach and someone else who came up with it to describe players who would get down and dirty.
And, isn't RemDawg an offshoot of that?
Love of Sox
Jun 24 2005, 09:39 PM
QUOTE(MBed @ Jun 24 2005, 07:25 PM) So basically he has moved a despicable image of racism and replaced it with a picture from a melee which cost the life of a Philadelphia police officer earlier this week. Nice.
What say the Globe about the trivial use of this photo? [right][snapback]338068[/snapback][/right]
Class act all the way. What a ****ing moron and a ****.
Blue Monkey
Jun 24 2005, 09:45 PM
I think alot of people on here are over reacting. I dont condone his use of that picture, but people make mistakes. So I'll give him a free pass. It's not like he has a history of poor taste. Stuff like this happens.
MBed
Jun 24 2005, 09:50 PM
QUOTE(Blue Monkey @ Jun 24 2005, 10:44 PM) I think alot of people on here are over reacting. I dont condone his use of that picture, but people make mistakes. So I'll give him a free pass. It's not like he has a history of poor taste. Stuff like this happens. [right][snapback]338079[/snapback][/right]
And the second picture? Using a photo from a scene where a police officer died trivialized to a manager's cold reception? I guess stuff like this happens twice in one day... I am not suggesting the man is a racist; I am suggesting he is quite ignorant...
Lou Duffys Cliff
Jun 24 2005, 09:53 PM
QUOTE(Blue Monkey @ Jun 24 2005, 07:44 PM) I think alot of people on here are over reacting. I dont condone his use of that picture, but people make mistakes. So I'll give him a free pass. It's not like he has a history of poor taste. Stuff like this happens. Obviously you haven't been to his site much, he is continually displaying poor taste.
Skip Romero
Jun 24 2005, 09:55 PM
That picture is seriously F'd up.
I'm constantly surprised and amazed by the number of times DD is mentioned on this board, but in this case he deserves it. For a sniveling, irrelevant prick, he has sure made a name for himself.
SuperManny
Jun 24 2005, 09:56 PM
That first picture is awful and in poor taste but I didn't see the second picture. I hadn't even heard of the incident in which the second picture is about. How did the police officer die?
BTW: You should probably take the picture off the original post too.
Pede
Jun 24 2005, 09:57 PM
Do you think DD will do any retracting of what he wanted to happen in tonight's Mets/Yankees game?
MBed
Jun 24 2005, 10:02 PM
QUOTE(SuperManny @ Jun 24 2005, 10:55 PM) That first picture is awful and in poor taste but I didn't see the second picture. I hadn't even heard of the incident in which the second picture is about. How did the police officer die?
BTW: You should probably take the picture off the original post too. [right][snapback]338086[/snapback][/right]
On June 21st, the officer had a fatal heart attack while on duty dealing with an out of control protest.
mvp wakefield
Jun 24 2005, 10:49 PM
I was shocked when I saw that picture earlier. But I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who was disturbed by it.
Blue Monkey
Jun 24 2005, 11:21 PM
QUOTE(B36 11 17 @ Jun 24 2005, 08:52 PM) Obviously you haven't been to his site much, he is continually displaying poor taste. [right][snapback]338084[/snapback][/right]
Actually i have been a daily visitor for the last 2-3 years now. Instead of poor taste i should have used the term offensive material. Most of the stuff on his site is comical but this is really the first time he's crossed the line. I'm just saying don't judge a person based on one bad choice.
Lou Duffys Cliff
Jun 24 2005, 11:30 PM
Poor taste, offensive material, not much of a difference. IMO he's crossed the line more than once in especially when it comes to his lack of fact checking. What's even worse is that the Globe allows him to get away with his shenanigans.
Dewey Rice
Jun 24 2005, 11:44 PM
I'm not surprised in the least, he's screwed up in the past and will do so again in the future. I blame the Globe more than him, for giving him even a shred of legitimacy. He is what he is. I can't see that relationship lasting too much longer.
Love of Sox
Jun 24 2005, 11:53 PM
I have a feeling that civil right organizations may catch wind of this situation as may the police officers associations of Boston and Philadelphia.
MFLetou
Jun 25 2005, 12:24 AM
I don't know, I consider myself fairly up to date, and quite frankly I didn't get what EITHER of those two pictures were really of. The one that is up there now, as far as I knew when I looked at it, could have been of any rally any time any place. Only reason I know otherwise is because somebody said so.
I'm no inclined to defend or criticize that particular site, I'm just saying that if I didn't pick up on what would make those two pictures offensive I'm sure many other people, including those that put them up, didn't either.
Love of Sox
Jun 25 2005, 12:41 AM
QUOTE(MFLetou @ Jun 24 2005, 10:23 PM) I don't know, I consider myself fairly up to date, and quite frankly I didn't get what EITHER of those two pictures were really of. The one that is up there now, as far as I knew when I looked at it, could have been of any rally any time any place. Only reason I know otherwise is because somebody said so.
I'm no inclined to defend or criticize that particular site, I'm just saying that if I didn't pick up on what would make those two pictures offensive I'm sure many other people, including those that put them up, didn't either. [right][snapback]338117[/snapback][/right]
You don't know what is offensive about a black man getting kicked in the head by segregationist thugs? Maybe you need to do some reading about the civil rights struggle in this country. Sheer ignorance of the poster, which I doubt since many of these black and white photos are ingrained in our national psyche from the police with dogs to the children at the school steps, is no excuse. You cannot excuse the inexcusable and you should be ashamed of yourself for trying to be so diplomatic. If you truly don't know about the civil right era, I'm sure this would be a good resource for you to utilize to learn more.
BklynSoxFan44
Jun 25 2005, 01:19 AM
Silva's site was funny at one point, but now he comes off as someone trying to be a news breaker. And remember last year after Game 3 of the ALCS, he had the "2004 Red Sox headstone" on his site. He'll throw any slumping player under the bus in a heartbeat. The picture he showed today was just plain offensive and ignorant.......
RSNLoyalty04
Jun 25 2005, 01:31 AM
I don't really care about Silva and his site anymore - in fact I just checked it yesterday for the first time in a LONG time, I forgot about it - His stuff was moderatley funny like awhile back, but now it's just repetitive and boring - tasteless. This pic doesn't suprise me, but it doesn't enrage me either - typical BDD.
teddykgb
Jun 25 2005, 08:28 AM
QUOTE(Love of Sox @ Jun 25 2005, 01:40 AM) You don't know what is offensive about a black man getting kicked in the head by segregationist thugs? Maybe you need to do some reading about the civil rights struggle in this country. Sheer ignorance of the poster, which I doubt since many of these black and white photos are ingrained in our national psyche from the police with dogs to the children at the school steps, is no excuse. You cannot excuse the inexcusable and you should be ashamed of yourself for trying to be so diplomatic. If you truly don't know about the civil right era, I'm sure this would be a good resource for you to utilize to learn more. [right][snapback]338120[/snapback][/right] Calm down. He said the same thing I said....he didn't really know what the picture was of. It was certainly the first time I have seen it, and I just didn't stop to examine it, as I'm not someone who really looks at pictures as much as words. It is possible to be ignorant of something like this, and when it comes to DD I'm willing to bank on ignorance
RedSoxAnni
Jun 25 2005, 08:40 AM
I can excuse the younger members of this board, because they may have seen that image for the first time. Those of us who were in college or high school in the 60's know the background of that photograph, however. And that includes Steve Silva. He's got to be in his mid-to-late 40's, or maybe older than that. He KNOWS what that image depicted. No way was posting that photograph "ignorance". Maybe it wasn't malicious, but it was incredibly insensitive. This is not the first time DD has shown his latent racism, and I'm sure it won't be the last.
Anni
yazgoesbacklooksupitsgone
Jun 25 2005, 08:55 AM
QUOTE quote=Tek123,Jun 24 2005, 09:37 PM] I don't think the nickname "Dirt Dogs" was originated by him. If I recall, it was Trot Nixon, Brian Daubach and someone else who came up with it to describe players who would get down and dirty.
[right][snapback]338075[/snapback][/right] you're almost right. It wasn't Nixon or Daubauch who came up with it, but it was used in reference to them, and it is extremely complimentary. The first use of the term "dirt dog" in regard to the red sox I could find via LexisNexis was in a Red Sox Notebook column by Gordon Edes on July 11, 2001 in the Boston Globe: QUOTE Some All-Star perspectives on how the Red Sox have managed to be in the middle of the race in the American League East despite injuries to Nomar Garciaparra, Jason Varitek, Pedro Martinez, and Everett, among others.
Paul Quantrill, the Blue Jays reliever who has seen way too much of the Sox in the last five weeks:
"The funny thing is, on paper, I feel that we are better than the Red Sox. You can't argue that the Blue Jays have pretty darn good players in their lineup. But the game isn't played on paper, and the Red Sox don't play on paper.
"They're just dirt dogs, a bunch of pigpens, and it seems like we've been saying that for the last two or three years. They have so much controversy to deal with, but maybe that's part of it. It seems their players just keep playing hard, they grind, they don't care if they're five runs down. That's nothing to them. They're not going to lay down.
"They just grind. And now they've had some guys who've been around a little bit, they've been through so much, and they've grown so much. Guys like Brian Daubach, and Jason Varitek, I don't think many of us thought he was anyone special, and now he's a big part of that team. And Trot Nixon may be the best example of all of a dirt dog."
Bernie Williams, the Yankees' center fielder: "They just have players who have been able to step up and pick it up, and have the depth to deal with all the injuries they've had.
"They've done a remarkable job. I think Jimy Williams has done a terrific job. So many times they find ways to win close games - the games that really decide so much in the long run.
"They just don't give up. It's a team that pays a lot of attention to detail, that is pretty fundamentally sound and doesn't make many mistakes."
Yankees reliever Mike Stanton: "They are just a scrappy, get-down-and-dirty ball club. That ball club has a definite personality, and it comes from the manager. I've played with Jimy, when he was a coach in Atlanta . . . and that's just how he is.
"He demands everything you've got. They're on him there? That just shows the tremendous character and tremendous resilience of Jimy Williams, that he continues to do the job even while they're dogging him in Boston." The first RemDawg reference I can find in print dates back to aug. of 2003, but it was probably in use some time before that. I always thought Remdawg was a play on Mo Vaugh's nickname, Hit Dog.
MTSUDaff
Jun 25 2005, 09:42 AM
Okay, I saw the picture of the civil rights protesters kicking the black man in the face yesterday when it was up on the site, and I'll be 100% honest when I say that the second I saw it I said to myself, "Jesus Christ, that's horrible." I couldn't believe that he used a picture like that. Just taking one glance at it should have made it blatantly obvious that it was completely inappropriate.
But the second picture being bitched about. Give me a break. So now any time someone uses a picture of any protest/riot and makes a joke about it, then they always need to do their research and find out if someone, in some place, at THAT event, was hurt it can't be used? That's crap. People bitching about that are just people who genuinely hate BDD (which is your right) and are saying whatever they can to bash the guy. There is no violent activity even taking place in the second picture, and I think you've got some personal issues if you think that that one is inappropriate. And then add on top of that that the cop who died died of a heart attack? Would there be outrage if the cop had died while downing a cheesesteak while on duty? Goddamn.
Look, I have had the guy PM me before, believe me. He is a jackass as a person, that's for sure, but that doesn't mean he is a target for anything and everything he puts up on his website. If anything, I agree with people who say we should be going to the Boston Globe after that first picture was posted.
RSN Diaspora
Jun 25 2005, 10:00 AM
The second picture is, in my opinion, not all that offensive.
The first, though, is absolutely vile. And unlike Silva, I was born after segregation, but even I wouldn't use such a photograph.
redsoxfaithful76
Jun 25 2005, 10:44 AM
I agree with alot of what has been said on the racist photo it was absolutley vile and ignorant. But the second Picture i thought was in no intent to create a stir once again. Listen the guy is a self-indulgent piece of garbarge but if we don't like what his site has to offer don't go on.
Love of Sox
Jun 25 2005, 12:59 PM
QUOTE(teddykgb @ Jun 25 2005, 06:27 AM) Calm down. He said the same thing I said....he didn't really know what the picture was of. It was certainly the first time I have seen it, and I just didn't stop to examine it, as I'm not someone who really looks at pictures as much as words. It is possible to be ignorant of something like this, and when it comes to DD I'm willing to bank on ignorance [right][snapback]338146[/snapback][/right]
It's amazing to me that they don't teach the civil rights era history in the schools today, apparently. There was ignorance (an arrogance) in the posting of the picture. The ignorance was to those who lost their lives in the struggle for civil rights, not to the photograph itself. What will this idiot do next, maybe use a picture of the US troops being dragged through Mogadishu? The ignorance excuse does not cut it.
BinacaMan
Jun 25 2005, 01:56 PM
QUOTE It's amazing to me that they don't teach the civil rights era history in the schools today, apparently. There was ignorance (an arrogance) in the posting of the picture. The ignorance was to those who lost their lives in the struggle for civil rights, not to the photograph itself. What will this idiot do next, maybe use a picture of the US troops being dragged through Mogadishu? The ignorance excuse does not cut it. You need to chill out. I re-read all the posts on this link and I haven't seen a single person say the first photo was anything but offensive and idiotic. That said, this ... QUOTE I have a feeling that civil right organizations may catch wind of this situation as may the police officers associations of Boston and Philadelphia. Is not going to happen. I'll eat my shoe if the NAACP or POA starts holding rallies because some dumbass with a Web site posted a dumb photo. I'm continually amazed at how much credence people around here give BDD. It's a fan site that long, long, long ago used to be moderately amusing. Now it isn't. Sure, Silva's a jackass. But the reaction to every misstep -- and this was a doozie -- gives his site more importance than its worth. My advice: Ignore stuff you don't like, even if it is hosted by El Globo.
chrisgeleven
Jun 25 2005, 02:07 PM
Got an e-mail from Bruce at BSMW...he says Boston.com "is issuing massive apologies for it." From the sounds of it, Boston.com is attempting to look like they are taking it seriously...but you know they aren't. I can't wait for his writeup on it...I'm sure it is coming by Monday. He's the one that broke the story about Dirt Dog's lack of fact checking a few months back in regards to Nomar wanting a ring or not. Boston.com knows they screwed up, but they don't seem to get the hint that this will happen again and again and again...
Love of Sox
Jun 25 2005, 02:18 PM
QUOTE(BinacaMan @ Jun 25 2005, 11:55 AM) You need to chill out...My advice: Ignore stuff you don't like, even if it is hosted by El Globo. [right][snapback]338230[/snapback][/right]
No, actually I don't and neither does any other person who was offended. I DID ignore the Dirt Dog site. I actually had taken it off of my bookmarks and had to type it in when I read this thread. My own written communication with someone else (who shall remain unnamed until such time as I get his permission) sums this up well... Boston and it's populace seem to be at times forgetful of the checkered past when it comes to race relations. The Red Sox have worked hard to dispel an image that seemed to have been fostered by a previous owner that they were a lily-white team and have apparently reached out to all ends of the Boston and New England communities. The Boston Globe as a major institution in the city has the responsibility not to support any venture that denigrates part of the citizenry. The citizens of Boston and the country at large should not support such a company.Ed: Keep in mind also that the NYT Company is part owner of the Red Sox
MTSUDaff
Jun 25 2005, 02:42 PM
QUOTE(Love of Sox @ Jun 25 2005, 02:17 PM) No, actually I don't and neither does any other person who was offended. I DID ignore the Dirt Dog site. I actually had taken it off of my bookmarks and had to type it in when I read this thread. My own written communication with someone else (who shall remain unnamed until such time as I get his permission) sums this up well...
Boston and it's populace seem to be at times forgetful of the checkered past when it comes to race relations. The Red Sox have worked hard to dispel an image that seemed to have been fostered by a previous owner that they were a lily-white team and have apparently reached out to all ends of the Boston and New England communities. The Boston Globe as a major institution in the city has the responsibility not to support any venture that denigrates part of the citizenry. The citizens of Boston and the country at large should not support such a company.
Ed: Keep in mind also that the NYT Company is part owner of the Red Sox [right][snapback]338240[/snapback][/right]
Agreed completely on that first photo. Make sure that the a**holes at the Globe who support this thing get a piece of your mind. I've said it many times, I go to his website all the time, but I don't think I'll be paying much attention to it after showing a photo of a white mob kicking a black man in the face during a period that can only be described as one of the biggest black eyes in the history of this country. That picture was not appropriate, and he shouldn't get a free pass because of some lame apology for it on the same page after he took it down. When you do something as stupid as he did you'd better expect, and accept, the consequences.
Nomar93
Jun 25 2005, 02:44 PM
Silva is the junior apprentice to the CHB.
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