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Born in the Bronx
QUOTE(Albert P. Schlegg @ May 11 2006, 11:25 AM) [snapback]516411[/snapback]

If you keep listening to him you'll hear the word "Jeterian".

Jeterian (adj.) 1. a general descriptor for anything that Derek Jeter does, particularly a single to right field 2. like, or as if, a Man-God

(used in context... Sterling: Oh, there it is again! That Jeterian, inside-out swing! Isn't he just amazing! Suzyn: Oh John, he's just dreamy. Derek Jeter.... mmm-mmm... Where were you 30 years ago?! Sterling: Suzyn, couldja wipe that up for me, thanks.)


One of my favorite Sterling calls of all-time was from a few years back. Jeter made a backhand stab and fired a one hopper to Tino at 1st base. Sterling said, " Oooooh what a play INVENTED by Derek Jeter!"
RSN Diaspora
QUOTE(JoltinJoe @ May 10 2006, 09:58 PM) [snapback]516169[/snapback]

Charlie Slowes is another Fordham guy I knew back in the day. Slowes, in fact, was Kay's successor as sports editor at what was called "the paper" (from January '82 until January '83). They were pretty tight. Slowes is a great guy with an incredible & professional voice. Another WFUV alum who got his start calling Fordham baseball.


Unlike most broacaster tag lines, I really like his "Bang, Zoom go the fireworks! A curly W is in the books!" at the end of Nats' home wins. During the Nats' amazing mid-season run last year, as they set off fireworks at the end of every home win, I grew quite fond of it.
bigbilly
Since Sterling has been brought up, part of an article by Phil Mushnick today may interest some, as it contrasts his coverage to YES's in one instance:

QUOTE
May 12, 2006 -- AFTER all these years, I should have known better.
Tuesday, I was in a tough spot. Returning home by car, I had no choice but to allow John Sterling, "Voice of the New York Yankees," to serve as my eyes for no less than a Red Sox-Yanks game.
In the top of the third, Boston trailed, 2-0, with two out and two on when Randy Johnson's 1-2 pitch to David Ortiz was called a ball. Sterling flipped. The pitch, he claimed, was, "right over the heart of the plate."
Sterling had made it clear that the Yanks had just been robbed and he eagerly named the perp - umpire Charlie Reliford. And, presumably after viewing a replay on his monitor, Sterling stuck with and furthered his story: If not for Reliford's incompetence, the inning would have ended with that 1-2 pitch.
Ortiz then reached - and a run scored - on an Alex Rodriguez error. Two more runs would score that half-inning. And, as Sterling reminded us, what should've been a 2-0 Yankee lead in the bottom of the third, was 3-2, Red Sox, because a pitch thrown "over the heart of the plate" was called a ball.
Sterling was so appalled - and so convincing - that I believed him. Almost. When I got home, just in case, I checked the tape.
On YES, the game-changing pitch that Sterling insisted was "over the heart of the plate" was not at issue. Why would it be? It wasn't even close to the plate, let alone its heart. Reliford's call of a pitch thrown well outside not only was a good call, it was an easy one.
But on WCBS Radio, a station that otherwise serves as an all-news station, Sterling reported that the game had gone from 2-0, Yanks, to 3-2, Red Sox, on a horrible call.
It's not just a matter of baseball fans being stuck with a guy whose self-serving signature calls so often supersede minimally accurate descriptions. It's also a matter of a fellow who can be dangerously inaccurate.
It's a matter of a professional broadcaster - the Voice of the New York Yankees, for crying out loud - who will report with great conviction that an entire game flipped on an outrageous happenstance that he just described and then repeated - and a happenstance that, well, never happened.


Here's the link
PhilA67
Sterling in my mind has surpassed Kay. At least Kay has Jim Kaat, Bobby Mercer, Al Leiter, Paul O'Neil et. al. in the booth to dilute him somewhat, and I actually like those guys. But Sterling is just too much for me for some reason and Suzyn Waldman can do little to control him. I don't mind Tokyo Rose, all that much. But I just can't stand John Sterling.
BklynSoxFan44
The YES network sunk to new lows on Wednesday night. Al Leiter, who I used to respect, said that Randy Johnson's putrid performance tonight merited a "B" grade. Even Kay and Singleton couldn't believe that. Kay harped ALL NIGHT LONG on Manny's posing at the plate on Tuesday night and wouldn't let it go. And in the eighth Kay went on another rant about Manny, saying he "embarrassed" Scott Proctor by hitting the homer tonight off him. (I'm still trying to figure that one out.) Tonight Kay thoroughly embarrassed the YES network and the Yankees with his childish BS. Thank God this series is over, and I can watch the Sox games again with Don and Jerry.

All Yankee fans should be embarrassed to have a broadcast team this bad on YES.
I'll have more about this fiasco on my blog on Thursday.
Botolph
QUOTE(BklynSoxFan44 @ May 25 2006, 01:59 AM) [snapback]523521[/snapback]

The YES network sunk to new lows on Wednesday night. Al Leiter, who I used to respect, said that Randy Johnson's putrid performance tonight merited a "B" grade. Even Kay and Singleton couldn't believe that. Kay harped ALL NIGHT LONG on Manny's posing at the plate on Tuesday night and wouldn't let it go. And in the eighth Kay went on another rant about Manny, saying he "embarrassed" Scott Proctor by hitting the homer tonight off him. (I'm still trying to figure that one out.) Tonight Kay thoroughly embarrassed the YES network and the Yankees with his childish BS. Thank God this series is over, and I can watch the Sox games again with Don and Jerry.

All Yankee fans should be embarrassed to have a broadcast team this bad on YES.
I'll have more about this fiasco on my blog on Thursday.


I can't wait to read it. Kay had one of his classic moments Monday in the ninth.
"Posada got a hold of that one..and that's going to be hard to catch"
Yes, very hard Michael, it went 4 rows up in the bleachers. That's about 30 feet from the field!

I'm so tired of hearing the Yankee media machine harping on which Red Sock should be beaned. They're preaching such a poor brand of baseball. We're hitting HRs off Yankee pitching? Well, try to get us out.
Edmund Dantes
I actually had to listen to part of the game on the radio today. So I got to hear Suzy and Sterling. They were shocked to hear all this talk about "Yankees were upset in the clubhouse with Manny". They said they didn't hear any of it when they were in the clubhouse last night or tonight. Their response to any Yankees' player (and they seemed to be alluding that they thought it was the pitcher) is that if you don't want Manny posing don't throw him 0-2 pitches he can jack out of the park. Strike him out, get him out, and he can't do the pose. They also couldn't figure out why it's such a big deal since this is nothing new, and Manny isn't that different from any number of guys in baseball.
Huntington Avenue Grounds
Last night was awful even by YES standards. Kay calling out Manny over the entire ballgame was simply homerism at it's best - or worst. Randy gets a "C" and "B" for his efforts from the booth, which begs the question, how the hell would a "D" grade look on a stat line?

Can't wait to read the blog BklynSoxFan44.
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(Edmund Dantes @ May 25 2006, 08:27 AM) [snapback]523550[/snapback]

... They were shocked to hear all this talk about "Yankees were upset in the clubhouse with Manny"...


What does the Yankee clubhouse sound like when it's upset?

A few guys whispering to eachother amongst the heavy silence of machined professionalism?

Passing notes surreptitiously?

Stern, knowing glares of determination and steely resolve?

Everyone looking earnestly to Jeter to see if he says anything?
Botolph
QUOTE(Edmund Dantes @ May 25 2006, 08:27 AM) [snapback]523550[/snapback]

I actually had to listen to part of the game on the radio today. So I got to hear Suzy and Sterling. They were shocked to hear all this talk about "Yankees were upset in the clubhouse with Manny". They said they didn't hear any of it when they were in the clubhouse last night or tonight. Their response to any Yankees' player (and they seemed to be alluding that they thought it was the pitcher) is that if you don't want Manny posing don't throw him 0-2 pitches he can jack out of the park. Strike him out, get him out, and he can't do the pose. They also couldn't figure out why it's such a big deal since this is nothing new, and Manny isn't that different from any number of guys in baseball.



If you so much as intimate that I agree with John Sterling again I swear to God I'll kill you. banghead.gif
Edmund Dantes
QUOTE(Botolph @ May 25 2006, 11:49 AM) [snapback]523655[/snapback]

If you so much as intimate that I agree with John Sterling again I swear to God I'll kill you. banghead.gif

Sorry. I nearly drove off the road when I heard it.
Born in the Bronx
Mighty Quinn,

I checked out your blog.

I was at the game on 9/10/99. It probably was the best pitched game I have ever seen. The Yankees had about a 5 game lead going into the game, so I don't think the division title was quite on the line though.

As a Yankee fan, 1999 was a special year. The Yankees went 11-1 in the postseason that year on their way to winning the World Series. The good old days.
Clyde Engle
QUOTE(Born in the Bronx @ May 25 2006, 02:09 PM) [snapback]523774[/snapback]

As a Yankee fan, 1999 was a special year. The Yankees went 11-1 in the postseason that year on their way to winning the World Series. The good old days.

That one loss, of course, being the much-hyped Pedro-vs.-Rocket clash, in which the Sox pounded out 21 hits (Nomar with four), en route to a 13-1 Sox victory. As for the matchup:

Martinez: 7IP, 2H, 0R, 12K
Clemens: 2IP, 6H, 5R, 2K -- relieved by Hideki Irabu (fat toad!) in the third

Unfortunately for the Nation, the Yankees were far better. The Sox were Pedro and Nomar and some other guys. For the series, the Sox actually outscored the Yankees despite losing the series 4-1.
Megas Alexandros
QUOTE(BklynSoxFan44 @ May 25 2006, 01:59 AM) [snapback]523521[/snapback]



All Yankee fans should be embarrassed to have a broadcast team this bad on YES.



Even as a Yankee fan it's nearly impossible to stomach Kay. Leiter has his moments and O'neill is excellent.

The Yankee radio broadcast however is absolutely terrible.
BklynSoxFan44
QUOTE(Born in the Bronx @ May 25 2006, 03:09 PM) [snapback]523774[/snapback]

Mighty Quinn,

I checked out your blog.

I was at the game on 9/10/99. It probably was the best pitched game I have ever seen. The Yankees had about a 5 game lead going into the game, so I don't think the division title was quite on the line though.

As a Yankee fan, 1999 was a special year. The Yankees went 11-1 in the postseason that year on their way to winning the World Series. The good old days.


Thanks for checking out my blog, BITB.

The division was still very much undecided by 9/12/99, as there was still 3 weeks to go in the season, and the Sox swept that series with the Yankees to get within 3 1/2 games (with 19 to play). But ultimately they didn't have the pitching to catch the Yankees.
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(Huntington Avenue Grounds @ May 25 2006, 10:19 AM) [snapback]523594[/snapback]

Last night was awful even by YES standards. Kay calling out Manny over the entire ballgame was simply homerism at it's best - or worst. Randy gets a "C" and "B" for his efforts from the booth, which begs the question, how the hell would a "D" grade look on a stat line?

Can't wait to read the blog BklynSoxFan44.

Just got home. Michael Kay devoted most of his show today to screeching about Manny's "posing" after hitting the home run, and how he needs to take one in the ribs for it.

Then, he has Tino Martinez on as a guest, and that's the main thing he wants to talk about.

Then, he takes phone calls about it and screeches some more. Really tiresome.

On the other hand, he gave Randy Johnson an "F" for last night's start.
Edmund Dantes
I couldn't believe he's still going off on this.
SFFM38
SSA, lets say if it was Jeter or no-neck roidboy did the same thing as manny did couple of nights ago, do you think one of those YES broadcasters would rip it up and all? I doubt that!
BklynSoxFan44
QUOTE(Sox Sweep Again @ May 25 2006, 06:44 PM) [snapback]523871[/snapback]

Just got home. Michael Kay devoted most of his show today to screeching about Manny's "posing" after hitting the home run, and how he needs to take one in the ribs for it.

Then, he has Tino Martinez on as a guest, and that's the main thing he wants to talk about.

Then, he takes phone calls about it and screeches some more. Really tiresome.

On the other hand, he gave Randy Johnson an "F" for last night's start.


I love it........Kay's advocating throwing at Red Sox players. Remember all the screeching those YES shills do when a Sox pitcher hits one of their own?

And during the game on Wednesday, he gave Johnson a "C." Now all of a sudden, it's an "F."

Kay's an f'n tool. He's best to be ignored.
Born in the Bronx
QUOTE(SFFM38 @ May 25 2006, 07:35 PM) [snapback]523893[/snapback]

SSA, lets say if it was Jeter or no-neck roidboy did the same thing as manny did couple of nights ago, do you think one of those YES broadcasters would rip it up and all? I doubt that!


Jeter and Giambi would never do what Manny did the other night. Whether you root for the Red Sox or the Yankees one would have to admit that showing up the opposing player is classless.
mwpeters8182
Come on, I really don't have a problem with it, no matter who does it. And to go as far to say it's "classless" is a bit of hyperbole, if you ask me. He did pose a little long, but if a pitcher doesn't like it, maybe he shouldn't be throwing meatballs down the heart of the plate.

The media attention that this gets surprises me every time. Who cares? The game's over, move on.
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(SFFM38 @ May 25 2006, 07:35 PM) [snapback]523893[/snapback]

SSA, lets say if it was Jeter or no-neck roidboy did the same thing as manny did couple of nights ago, do you think one of those YES broadcasters would rip it up and all? I doubt that!

I'm sure he wouldn't, but I can't really imagine Jeter posing after a homer. I hate his guts, but that's not really his style.

Giambi always scuttles quickly around the bases because he knows that every homer he hits is tainted, and he's ashamed every time he hits one, wracked with guilt, but he has a hefty contract to fulfill. whistle.gif

I don't expect objectivity from the YES guys, however, any more than I would from EEI.

It just bothers me that two days after the fact, and one night after the Yankees take 2 of 3 in Boston, Kay has nothing better to rant about.

Sheesh, Manny didn't pose that long. It's fine with me if he angers the Yankees, because angry Yankees play poorly. They don't have the team chemistry to fight well together. Tino Martinez said that on the Kay show yesterday. "This is a different kind of team than the first time I was with the Yankees. They're not really there yet, they're still finding team footing. If Manny had done that when, say, Strawberry was around, Strawberry would have chased him around the field and up the clubhouse tunnel, or even into the stands if he had to."
Born in the Bronx
QUOTE(mwpeters8182 @ May 26 2006, 09:16 AM) [snapback]524084[/snapback]

Come on, I really don't have a problem with it, no matter who does it. And to go as far to say it's "classless" is a bit of hyperbole, if you ask me. He did pose a little long, but if a pitcher doesn't like it, maybe he shouldn't be throwing meatballs down the heart of the plate.

The media attention that this gets surprises me every time. Who cares? The game's over, move on.


I guess I'm just a little old school when it comes to those type of displays. I do agree though, it's over, Kay should move on to something else.
SuperManny
QUOTE(Born in the Bronx @ May 26 2006, 09:11 AM) [snapback]524082[/snapback]

Jeter and Giambi would never do what Manny did the other night. Whether you root for the Red Sox or the Yankees one would have to admit that showing up the opposing player is classless.


Yeah its really too bad Manny stares at his homeruns and can't do steroids like the "classy" Giambi. I think cheating is a little more classless myself but maybe its just me.

I also remember hearing that Proctor had a quote about overpowering Manny when he K'd him in the last series and that might have been the reason why.
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(SuperManny @ May 26 2006, 09:32 AM) [snapback]524092[/snapback]

Yeah its really too bad Manny stares at his homeruns and can't do steroids like the "classy" Giambi. I think cheating is a little more classless myself but maybe its just me.

I also remember hearing that Proctor had a quote about overpowering Manny when he K'd him in the last series and that might have been the reason why.


laugh.gif
After the series that Proctor just had, where the Red Sox reminded him that he is, indeed, Scott Proctor, he oughta just shut his yap.

I didn't see that quote though.
SuperManny
Oh yeah and add to that the fact that the guy who supposedly talked to Manny about this classless act is slappy himself. Maybe AROD should try not to slap at players that are trying to tag him out on the basepath before he tells people how to respect other teams.

And didn't Reggie Jackson used to do that when he would hit bombs?
Born in the Bronx
QUOTE(SuperManny @ May 26 2006, 09:32 AM) [snapback]524092[/snapback]

Yeah its really too bad Manny stares at his homeruns and can't do steroids like the "classy" Giambi. I think cheating is a little more classless myself but maybe its just me.

I also remember hearing that Proctor had a quote about overpowering Manny when he K'd him in the last series and that might have been the reason why.


Of course steroids are worse, but it still doesn't change the fact that Manny did a classless thing.

Regarding the Proctor quote, this isn't the first time Manny has done something like this.

Last year, Randy Johnson stared down Millar after striking him out. Millar was furious that Johnson "showed him up". I agreed with Millar. It's the same thing in this instance, show emotion if you wish, just don't be a jerk.
BklynSoxFan44
QUOTE(Born in the Bronx @ May 26 2006, 09:11 AM) [snapback]524082[/snapback]

Jeter and Giambi would never do what Manny did the other night. Whether you root for the Red Sox or the Yankees one would have to admit that showing up the opposing player is classless.


It's true Jeter and Giambi don't pose at the plate. As I said on my blog, I hate when ANYONE does that, including Manny. It's classless and it shows up the pitcher. I wish he'd knock that crap off for good. (But it was interesting on those two blasts he hit Wednesday, there was NO posing.)

But Michael Kay should get a grip. Manny didn't commit a capital crime here. The Yankees have far bigger problems than Manny's posing during his homers. (Here's a novel way for Yankee pitchers to stop it: don't throw Manny any meatballs he can hit out of sight.)
Born in the Bronx
QUOTE(BklynSoxFan44 @ May 26 2006, 10:58 AM) [snapback]524130[/snapback]

It's true Jeter and Giambi don't pose at the plate. As I said on my blog, I hate when ANYONE does that, including Manny. It's classless and it shows up the pitcher. I wish he'd knock that crap off for good.


Exactly!!

Mighty Quinn might just be my favorite Sox blogger!

Isn't there a Mighty Quinn in the Daily News too?


Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(BklynSoxFan44 @ May 26 2006, 10:58 AM) [snapback]524130[/snapback]


But Michael Kay should get a grip. Manny didn't commit a capital crime here. The Yankees have far bigger problems than Manny's posing during his homers. (Here's a novel way for Yankee pitchers to stop it: don't throw Manny any meatballs he can hit out of sight.)

The Yankees aren't particularly "classy" anyway. That's an old myth from the days when they might have been.

When your roster contains Giambi, Sheffield and Randy Johnson- all major-league assholes- you're off to a bad start on the "class" issue.

A-Rod's little bitchslap will be on replays for years, and made his whole team look like a bunch of little babies- it's got to be one of the least "classy" things done on the baseball national stage since Roseboro.

Let's not forget it was the New York Yankees who were crying for a forfeit by Tampa Bay a couple years ago, when they were stuck in their hurricane-ravaged home state!

Aren't the Yankees the ones who posted signs tweaking MLB for taking a few of their stars to the Classic this spring? Classy!

George Steinbrenner and his illegal donations to Nixon, his twice being banned from baseball, and his private surveillance of one of his star players? Yup... Yankee Class.

Billy Martin managed this team five times.

Nuf Ced.
JohntheBaptist
Baseball is entertainment. What Manny did was entertaining.

Kay screaming about it for 9 innings is, for that fanbase, entertaining.

I give this whole thing 4 "who gives a shit"s out of 5.
Kettleer
Out of pure ignorant curiosity...

Why is it such a bad thing? This may be because I am younger and all that, but when you hit a no doubter, I see no reason to put your head down and run as if it was a walk on 4 pitches. I just don't see it as a problem, and I am a guy who hates sack dances, and touchdown dances and the shirt pull and the brush your shoulders off and all the real extra stuff.

I just don't know where it (unwritten rule on home run ettiquette) came from.

If its for the sake of not showing up the pitcher that is lame. The discussion in the high school blowout thread is along the same lines, if you don't want to be embarrassed, don't throw meat down the heart of the plate.

Someone please explain this to me, I am willing to listen to an open mind.
JohntheBaptist
QUOTE
Why is it such a bad thing?


Because the "old schoolers" don't like anything that isn't the way "it used to be played," and this includes shows of emotion like this. See also Manny's HR in Game 5 of the 2003 ALDS. Thom Brennaman is still angry about that.

I was hoping after he hit his 2nd in 2 nights off Proctor, Manny would have pulled out an easel and stool and sat at homeplate sketching the arc and path of the ball. Oh well.

If a Yankee did this- and more than a few have- I'd be "pissed" in the same way I was "pissed" at 5 years old watching the Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase wail on Hacksaw Jim Duggan. Its fun to get mad at the villains, and it's fun to revel in victory.

BFD.

edit- calling it "classless" is pretty funny, too
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(JohntheBaptist @ May 26 2006, 12:31 PM) [snapback]524172[/snapback]


I give this whole thing 4 "who gives a shit"s out of 5.

That's pretty entertaining.

QUOTE(JohntheBaptist @ May 26 2006, 12:43 PM) [snapback]524182[/snapback]


I was hoping after he hit his 2nd in 2 nights off Proctor, Manny would have pulled out an easel and stool and sat at homeplate sketching the arc and path of the ball. Oh well.


As is that!

laugh.gif

Your analysis is spot-on. I do understand that giving up a home run sucks like a gut-punch, and you want the guy who just punched you to get out of your sight rapidly, but yes, they're over-blowing this.

It will be a topic again today I'm sure as well, since the Yankees had yesterday off. Kay's had a full day to come up with some new spins on "What the Yankees Should Do About Ramirez."


Botolph
QUOTE(Kettleer @ May 26 2006, 12:35 PM) [snapback]524177[/snapback]

Out of pure ignorant curiosity...

Why is it such a bad thing? This may be because I am younger and all that, but when you hit a no doubter, I see no reason to put your head down and run as if it was a walk on 4 pitches. I just don't see it as a problem, and I am a guy who hates sack dances, and touchdown dances and the shirt pull and the brush your shoulders off and all the real extra stuff.

I just don't know where it (unwritten rule on home run ettiquette) came from.

If its for the sake of not showing up the pitcher that is lame. The discussion in the high school blowout thread is along the same lines, if you don't want to be embarrassed, don't throw meat down the heart of the plate.

Someone please explain this to me, I am willing to listen to an open mind.


It's a good question. There used to be a lot of unwritten rules in MLB, but they seem to be all drifting away.
It wasn't long ago that pitchers were criticized for a fist-pump after a strike out. Now, Randy Johnson and Josh Beckett never hear a word about it.
Jermaine Van Buren Fan
QUOTE(BklynSoxFan44 @ May 25 2006, 11:45 PM) [snapback]524021[/snapback]

I love it........Kay's advocating throwing at Red Sox players. Remember all the screeching those YES shills do when a Sox pitcher hits one of their own?

And during the game on Wednesday, he gave Johnson a "C." Now all of a sudden, it's an "F."

Kay's an f'n tool. He's best to be ignored.


He has to lick Johnson's balls when he's on TV. He's got a ton more freedom on the radio.
Botolph
QUOTE(Jermaine Van Buren Fan @ May 26 2006, 12:54 PM) [snapback]524187[/snapback]

He has to lick Johnson's balls when he's on TV. He's got a ton more freedom on the radio.


But spitballs are illegal.
Born in the Bronx
QUOTE(Kettleer @ May 26 2006, 12:35 PM) [snapback]524177[/snapback]

Out of pure ignorant curiosity...

Why is it such a bad thing? This may be because I am younger and all that, but when you hit a no doubter, I see no reason to put your head down and run as if it was a walk on 4 pitches. I just don't see it as a problem, and I am a guy who hates sack dances, and touchdown dances and the shirt pull and the brush your shoulders off and all the real extra stuff.

I just don't know where it (unwritten rule on home run ettiquette) came from.

If its for the sake of not showing up the pitcher that is lame. The discussion in the high school blowout thread is along the same lines, if you don't want to be embarrassed, don't throw meat down the heart of the plate.

Someone please explain this to me, I am willing to listen to an open mind.



It's for the same reason why you probably hate sack dances and touchdown celebrations. There's no need to be a showoff and bring attention to yourself. It's been baseball etiquette for as long as the game has been played, however, there seems to be more toleration of these displays during recent years.

I remember a few years back when Raul Mondesi first joined the Yankees. He hit a homerun and did a "Manny" pose at home plate. When he got back to the dugout, Joe Torre went up to him and whispered, "we don't do that here". There were no further Mondesi displays. Unfortunately, managers have lots of things they can't control (steroids, etc...) but they can control how professional their players act on the field. Manny's (and Pedro's) childish behavior was and has always been tolerated by Red sox managers. I guess they never had a "Mondesi" type chat with their manager.

Peter Gammons was on the radio the other day. He said that Red Sox management feels that the team has been too unprofessional over the past few years. He said that they are now making a real effort to bring in more professional players. I think they are doing the right thing.
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(Botolph @ May 26 2006, 12:50 PM) [snapback]524186[/snapback]

It's a good question. There used to be a lot of unwritten rules in MLB, but they seem to be all drifting away.
It wasn't long ago that pitchers were criticized for a fist-pump after a strike out. Now, Randy Johnson and Josh Beckett never hear a word about it.

That's solely because of the class exhibited on a moment-by-moment basis by the Master of the Fist-Pump.

IPB Image
IPB Image
IPB Image

Such perfection in form.

/Man I hate that assclown.
Botolph
QUOTE(Born in the Bronx @ May 26 2006, 12:57 PM) [snapback]524190[/snapback]

It's for the same reason why you probably hate sack dances and touchdown celebrations. There's no need to be a showoff and bring attention to yourself. It's been baseball etiquette for as long as the game has been played, however, there seems to be more toleration of it during recent years.

I remember a few years back when Raul Mondesi first joined the Yankees. He hit a homerun and did a "Manny" pose at home plate. When he got back to the dugout, Joe Torre went up to him and whispered, "we don't do that here". There were no further Mondesi displays. Unfortunately, managers have lots of things they can't control (steroids, etc...) but they can control how professional their players act on the field. Manny's (and Pedro's) childish behavior was and has always been tolerated by Red sox managers. I guess they never had a "Mondesi" moment.

Peter Gammons was on the radio the other day. He said that Red Sox management feels that the team has been too unprofessional over the past few years. He said that they are now making a real effort to bring in more professional players. I think they are doing the right thing.


You must have SOME ears to be able to hear Torre's whispers.

Your statement is patently false. It has not "been baseball etiquette for as long as the game has been played".

This is a phenomenon of MLB, and a relatively recent phenomenon in my opinion. Ruth was an enormous show off, and he was the most celebrated player of his era.

But moreso, the Negro Leagues were famous for "showing off". Paige used to call in his entire defense. Gibson used to take two strikes before swinging. Tiant used to walk Bell just so he could try to pick him off. They were entertaining. It's a brand of baseball some people don't like. But, that doesn't mean it's worse. (BTW, all of the aforementioned shananigans have something in common: They all happened at Yankee Stadium.)


I am biased, but I don't think Manny's posing. It seems to me that he's just watching the HR. He hits bombs!

EDIT: Great collage SSA.
SuperManny
I asked it before and I hadn't seen an answer - I heard that Reggie Jackson used to "pose" after hitting a HR for the Yankees - is this true? I'm too young to remember and don't really recall from the footage I've seen.

Again though - nothing like getting baseball etiquette tips from "slappy" about how the game is played. Probably the last person who should be having that conversation.

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rominer
QUOTE(Botolph @ May 26 2006, 10:06 AM) [snapback]524197[/snapback]

I am biased, but I don't think Manny's posing. It seems to me that he's just watching the HR. He hits bombs!


This is what it comes down to.

Posing is something you do if you're a media whore.

Barry Bonds might pose (and then shrug it off with, "I don't want the attention. But when the ball left the bat, I was thinking about how many of those Albert Pujols might hit someday."). Other guys who love the spotlight might pose.

I can't recall Manny really being a guy who loves the media attention, though. I suppose I've probably just misread him all these years. But I've always gotten the sense that stepping into the batter's box is an intense, personal experience for the man - his sanctuary, you might even say - so when he stops to see the results, the pitcher is the furthest thing from his mind.

Maybe that's part of the "Manny being Manny" mythology, but I just don't think Manny goes out there to show anyone up. Except maybe when he takes a bad swing to set the pitcher up for a good one. whistle.gif
Ponchar!
QUOTE(Sox Sweep Again @ May 26 2006, 12:59 PM) [snapback]524192[/snapback]

That's solely because of the class exhibited on a moment-by-moment basis by the Master of the Fist-Pump.

(Graphics excised)

Such perfection in form.

/Man I hate that assclown.


Where's all the outrage about Farnsworth, who seemed to do a fist pump after every K?

I think he showed up Papi on Wednesday night. I also think Red Sox Nation should issue a fatwa against Mr. Kyle Farnsworth, who not only humiliated our Heavenly Warrior, Big Papi, but also belittled the manhood of every soul in this holy nation of believers.

Excuse me while I have an apoplectic fit and start the official "What Are We Gonna Do About Farnsworth?" thread.
Kettleer
Fistpumps are fine by me, too. Seriously, is he supposed to be unphased by something like that?

He isn't humiliating anyone, he isn't belittling anyone. He is happy he struck out one of the better hitters in the game in a a ballsy situation.

People get happy, deal.
Sox Sweep Again
QUOTE(Ponchar! @ May 26 2006, 02:47 PM) [snapback]524247[/snapback]

Where's all the outrage about Farnsworth, who seemed to do a fist pump after every K?


Well, Farnsworth's not very good, so he just looks stupid when he pumps it.

Beckett and Jeter are good, so they're allowed.
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I still hate that assclown, though.
BklynSoxFan44
QUOTE(Born in the Bronx @ May 26 2006, 11:57 AM) [snapback]524156[/snapback]

Exactly!!

Mighty Quinn might just be my favorite Sox blogger!

Isn't there a Mighty Quinn in the Daily News too?


And you may be my favorite Yankee fan on this board, BiTB!!

Thanks for the kind words.

Yes, The Daily News has a "Mighty Quinn" also, but we are not related.

I am pissed at him for stealing my nickname though......

QUOTE(SuperManny @ May 26 2006, 01:28 PM) [snapback]524216[/snapback]

I asked it before and I hadn't seen an answer - I heard that Reggie Jackson used to "pose" after hitting a HR for the Yankees - is this true? I'm too young to remember and don't really recall from the footage I've seen.



SM, Reggie Jackson is The Godfather for the posers at home plate. His most famous one was when he hit the homer in the All-Star Game in Detroit in 1971 off Dock Ellis that hit the light tower and came back on to the field. He kept doing it even after he signed with the Yankees in 1977.

Years later, when they were both in the AL, Ellis threw a pitch at Jackson that nearly took his head off, and Ellis later admitted it was retaliation for Reggie's posing after hitting the home run.
JohntheBaptist
QUOTE(BklynSoxFan44 @ May 26 2006, 11:49 PM) [snapback]524552[/snapback]

SM, Reggie Jackson is The Godfather for the posers at home plate. His most famous one was when he hit the homer in the All-Star Game in Detroit in 1971 off Dock Ellis that hit the light tower and came back on to the field. He kept doing it even after he signed with the Yankees in 1977.

Years later, when they were both in the AL, Ellis threw a pitch at Jackson that nearly took his head off, and Ellis later admitted it was retaliation for Reggie's posing after hitting the home run.

One guy hits a ball over 500 feet in an exhibition game, and watches it, as nearly any breathing creature would.

The other fires a projectile upwards of 92 MPH at another human being's head for besting him in a game.

And you're taking the latter in the good guy vote? Yea, great call.
BklynSoxFan44
QUOTE(JohntheBaptist @ May 27 2006, 12:43 AM) [snapback]524559[/snapback]

One guy hits a ball over 500 feet in an exhibition game, and watches it, as nearly any breathing creature would.

The other fires a projectile upwards of 92 MPH at another human being's head for besting him in a game.

And you're taking the latter in the good guy vote? Yea, great call.


Hey man, I'm not saying what Ellis did was right. ("Good guy vote?" Huh??) Just saying he was royally pissed at Jackson for what he did and never forgot it.

It may have been an exhibition game, but it was seen by millions of people and was repeated 100 million times on TV since it happened. And Jackson set a bad precedent by staring and admiring it.
Botolph
QUOTE(JohntheBaptist @ May 27 2006, 12:43 AM) [snapback]524559[/snapback]

One guy hits a ball over 500 feet in an exhibition game, and watches it, as nearly any breathing creature would.

The other fires a projectile upwards of 92 MPH at another human being's head for besting him in a game.

And you're taking the latter in the good guy vote? Yea, great call.



I really don't see any judgement in BSF44's post. I think this is just another one of those dialectics that polerizes the fans leading to plenty of discussion, bar talk, etc.

It's what makes baseball great.
JohntheBaptist
QUOTE(Botolph @ May 27 2006, 01:54 PM) [snapback]524634[/snapback]

I really don't see any judgement in BSF44's post. I think this is just another one of those dialectics that polerizes the fans leading to plenty of discussion, bar talk, etc.

It's what makes baseball great.

I just hear stuff like this everytime someone like Manny does what he did the other night. I hear how if you pulled a ball foul off Bob Gibson, he'd aim one at the guy's head. If you had the temerity to stroke a single back up the middle, you'd get one in the ribs.

What the hell's the point of these stories? To me, they say "Bob Gibson and Dock Ellis are infantile pussies and borderline sociopathic." I don't know them, I don't know if that's true, and a lot of those stories seem apocryphal. But the people telling them seem to put more value on aiming a ball at a player as hard as possible over a guy hitting a HR and having a little fun.

Whatever, as I said, I couldn't possibly care less about this sort of thing. I just think these anecdotes regarding the reaction to showboating don't really help anyone's argument.
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