Red Sox get Kotsay

The Red Sox today officially acquired outfielder Mark Kotsay from the Atlanta Braves in exchange for minor league outfielder Luis Sumoza.

Kotsay is expected to join the team in New York and will wear No. 11. According to MLB.com, he was hoping to make it to Yankee Stadium in time for tonight's game (he was trying to catch a flight from Atlanta to New York).

The 32-year-old is batting .289 with 6 homers and 37 RBIs in 81 games this season.

"To be with the Red Sox will be cool," Kotsay told MLB.com. "I've always said there were a couple of teams I'd like to play for, with Atlanta being one of them. But I'm looking forward to joining the Red Sox and being in the pennant race."

I have mixed feelings about this trade now. I think Sumoza might have been a tad much, but the Red Sox needed someone. Sumoza was having a fine year.

Nice move. This team needed some more OF depth with Drew hurt and Moss gone in the Manny deal.

Do they need to send someone down to AAA to make room for him? If so, who?

Drew's on the DL, there's room.

I would assume they'd just demote Thurston...

Drew was replaced by Wakefield.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i2IwD0e...J3e4ogD92QAIC80

Not for nothing but why wasn't outfield depth addressed at or around the time Manny & Moss were dealt?

Geesh, does Kotsay get a police escort from JFK to the toilet tonight, Mirabelli style? I don't know, the Sox moves this summer just appear desperate to me. Now it's throw everything they can against the proverbial wall in hopes that something eventually will stick.

It's NYC, not Boston. NYPD will probably put up roadblocks.

People from the original WAU my remember that Sumoza's mom is married to a man who is related to a woman who married my father in law's brother, so were practically like family.

I don't really like the trade. Kotsay is meh, and Sumoza is one of the top prospects in Lowell this year, while being one of the youngest players in the league. He's very raw (lots of Ks), but has a lot of potential. I can't believe they'd ship him out for a half season's worth of Mark Kotsay.

You're just pissed because you thought your homeboy could get you Sox tickets.

I like the trade. To me, getting a legit OF for the stretch for a mid tier prospect is one you make every time.

How's Kotsay's back these days? I remember that towards the end of his time with Oakland, chronic back pain really hampered him in all phases of the game.

1. Drew wasn't injured
2. The cost would've been too high

There are some things that are best done at the Aug 31 deadline rather than the July 31 deadline. Picking up a 5th OF is one of those things. Desperation? I'd bet you dollars to doughnuts this is actually by design.

And why the hell would a team that is 90% likely to make the playoffs be desperate?

Fixed that.



Link

Well, if that 90% likely to make the playoffs team lost one of their best position players to, let's say, a back injury that might end his season, that might cause some desperation. Especially if that player was a legitimate candidate for both a gold glove and a silver slugger this year.

Not that I hate the Kotsay pickup. I don't know much about the prospect that was given up, but Kotsay is an improvement for the bench of the big club. Even in a best-case scenario where Drew comes back quickly, Kotsay could still earn some starts in center over the lackluster combination of Ellsbury and Crisp.

That's two young, athletic, high ceiling IFAs theyve shipped out in the last year (Beltre in the Gagne trade being the other).

I understand the thought process, because Carribean players tend to peak early in their development... BUT these two were both exceptional five tool athletes... and while it was unlikely that they hit their considerable ceilings, its going to hurt if they do.

Id still do the trade. We have a great team here, still leading the league in run differential. We've fought hard all year and have a great record despite substantial injuries hampering us all year. You cant let a Drew injury ruin the year and its very capable of doing that. This reminds me of Stern for Javy Lopez...

Please, never mention Javy Lopez again. That the Sox couldn't find a better stopgap catcher showed an immense lack of creativity. Speaking of which, where's Adam Stern these days? He would be nice to have around right about now.

Coco was rumored to be the ‘extra’ OFer that was to be traded this past spring, Ellsbury commeth and all was good! Heck, many didn't believe Coco would even be on the opening day roster. Then Manny forces the Red Sox hand, Moss gets shipped to Pitt & JD is looking like the hunchback of ND and further, they have no quality MLB ready OFers on the farm to fill in. Now the RS are forced to trade a rising prospect for a one month rental who has his own history of back injuries to boot. Clearly, this wasn't by design of the RS.

Edit: Yes, we needed a trade like this to shore up our OF. However, I don't have to be pleased by the turn of events that have led up to it.

Stern is at Baltimore's AAA affiliate, Norfolk, with a line of .221 .254 .303. He can probably still go got them in the outfield though.

Adam Stern? I think he's recently out of baseball. His last game was June 8th for Norfolk, and he's not listed on any roster.

Lopez didnt work out too well, but it was still a move we had to make to save the season. Im hoping this works out differently, but my larger point is we shouldnt judge it too harshly considering our hands were tied... we basically had to make this move. There was nobody else this good available - not that Kotsay is anything special.

No top prospect was moved here. If the Sox trotted Jason Lane or some 4A retread out there I would suspect that everyone would bitch about depth. Kotsay isn't a bad move at all. Sumoza was the same age (20) as guys like Kalish and Place, who are two levels ahead of him, not to mention Reddick, who is just a year older and is in AA, or someone like Lin, who is a year young and still a level ahead of him. Sumoza is all potential right now. You don't pass up on Mark Kotsay now because of a kid just out of the GCL.

If he pans out, fine, but it isn't like the Red Sox are hard pressed for OF talent in their system.

And they would be wrong to bitch about the lack of depth if Lane was put out there? I'm pretty happy about this trade... Lane is hitting .167 in Pawtucket and it looks like the team isn't willing to give Van Every the shot he deserves.

Hey Jackson, can you pop him (Lane) square in the nuts with your cane if you get the opportunity?

The difference being that Adam Stern's ceiling was about 5'10" high, and he couldn't reach it if he jumped.

With these kind of deals, though, the ends always justify the means. If the Sox win the World Series, it doesn't matter what the kid does in the future. If the Sox miss the playoffs, half a season of flash-in-the-pan greatness from Sumoza is enough to make the deal look bad.



Then they'll both fall down. Who will help them up?

Between real injuries and fake injuries, the Red Sox continue to dodge the bullet, coming up with waiver deals when holes develop. The front office is doing a good job trying to keep the team in the playoff hunt.
Just count all the injuries they've had--a typical year after a Championship when Murphy's Law seems to take hold. That's what makes repeating so difficult.
On the bright side, they've discovered their SS in Lowrie, Lester looks like a #2 starter, they are set in LF with Bay for a long time, and Masterson has shown he belongs. If they could get Delcarmen figured out, they might have a decent bullpen. Buchholz, too.

A yankee fan and Jason Lane... who would want to help them up?

He was playing for Canada during the Olympics ... not sure whether he's still hooked on with the Baltimore affiliate.

Speaking strictly from an odds standpoint, it is infinitely more likely that Mark Kotsay will do something positive for the Sox over the next 5-6 weeks than Sumoza ever will.

It's really more of a testament to the extreme depth of the farm now that Theo can use these Latin lottery tickets as chips to fill holes in a pennant chase.

A little steep probably, but there supposedly was another team bidding (Phillies).

OK, so if getting OF depth is a desperation move, that means the Sox tried hard at the July 31 deadline to get some and couldn't, and then panicked before the Aug 31 deadline and got reamed in a deal.

Is there any evidence either of those things happened? Or are we just freaking out over giving up a nobody for a nobody because we're Boston fans?

Interestingly Kotsay may get some time at 1B.



http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/basebal...&position=3

Well I'm finally convinced something is wrong with Casey then. I know he had a stiff neck, but his lack of playing time with all of the injuries this team has had is stunning. Why Kotsay would get any time at first over Casey is a mystery.

Yes, because I was saying exactly that. I'm pretty sure the rest of my post is in agreement with what you're saying; I too am happy with the trade.

Baseball Almanac shows him as having played 28 games at first in an 11 game MLB career, most recently 4 games with the A's in 2006. He is a talented fielder and first base doesn't take a ton of talent.

I think we're 'freaking out' because:
Apr 2008...............................Oct: 2008
Manny-Ellsbury/Coco-Drew > Bay-Ellsbury-Coco-Kotsay (pick 3)

We know how we got to the current OF that we have but none the less, we're potentially marching out the weakest starting OF in the 08 playoffs in recent memory as a RS fan. I understand why Kotsay was acquired however, I'm less than confident with the strength of our current OF and disappointed that a better acquisition wasn't made (back in July) in light of Manny & Moss being shipped out.

1B actually takes a tremendous amount of talent. I think 1B defense is very under-rated because teams tend to hide their powerful sluggers at the position. 1B don't have to have great range, but they do have to be able to stretch and pick balls in the dirt. A bad 1B can lead to more runners advancing to 2B. They also are involved in making the most outs in a game. Imagine the defense at 1B with an Adam Dunn type as opposed to what we are now used to seeing with Kevin Youkilis.

I was going to say that 1B requires the least amount of fielding talent of all the positions (excluding P), and I don't know where that is quantified, but I think it's true. So, I said 1B doesn't take a ton of talent instead. Don't get me wrong, I completely appreciate what Youkilis does over there, and scorn what Giambi does (or doesn't do). It's just that you won't see Theo telling a mostly career OFer to bring his infielder's glove.

I think the real issue is why in the world would we need him to play 1B with Sean Casey on the roster? Casey wasn't banged up enough to be DL'd, is presumably ready to play, and hasn't gotten an AB in this series and isn't starting today. Something weird is going on with Casey.

What was the better option than Bay? Who knew Drew's back would be in this bad of shape then?

I'm not criticizing the acquisition of Bay. However, Drew's back could just as easily have been Coco's hamstring or Bay's knees or Ellsbury's eyeball (it almost fell out when he hit the wall in Sunday's game ) What about just resting guys in Sept. in preperation for the playoffs (Bay has played every game since being acquired).

You lost 2 outfielders in Manny & Moss and only recieved one in return.
It only took one injury, which we now have in Drew, to leave us scrambling for depth, thus Kotsay is onboard. We simply haven't had OF depth since the July trades I would have hoped that the Sox would have better planned for the sceniro that we have today.

So Moss was the loss that facilitated a "panic" deal?

You make no sense.

The team picked up a 5th OF at the waiver deadline, which is exactly what a team should do. Bay-Coco-Ellsbury is an unfortunate consequence of the Drew injury, and having your 4th OF become a starter. But if you expected the team to "fix" it at the deadline, that means you expected them to pick up someone who's better than Coco or Ellsbury, and if you were expecting that I don't think you understand much about MLB.

Weaker than the Rays who started Hinske, Gabe Gross and Upton last night?

Stern was released by Norfolk in June and is currently a free agent.

http://www.thelondoner.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1163028

</hijack>

When Sean Casey attempted to hit Tuesday, he did more damage than good. Casey apparently aggravated his stiff neck, and remained on the bench. The first baseman hasn't played since last Thursday.

"It actually knocked him backwards a little bit," manager Terry Francona said yesterday.

While J.D. Drew was placed on the disabled list Tuesday, the team intends to wait with Casey.

"If there is [a chance for him to go on the DL], we're not going to do it yet," Francona said. "[General manager] Theo [Epstein] and I kind of talked through that today a little bit. We'd rather not. I think with a stiff neck, we feel like there's more of an opportunity for him to show up and feel better than with a back. So we're going to hold off on that one."
Casey Tweaks Neck

You mean the best defensive OF in the 08 playoffs? ...and that aside, youre seriously underrating Jason Bay. Besides, you cant go out and find a JD Drew replacement this time of year - even though they tried (Giles) - and I certainly dont see how you could fault them for not trading for another .900 OPS corner OFer in June... some injuries you just cant prepare for or find replacements for. In either case I certainly dont agree we have the weakest OF. Hell, the Rays marched Ruggiano-Upton-Zobrist(Gross) out there last night... am I supposed to be impressed by that? That's like our OF minus the defense and minus Jason Bay.

Moss being shipped out is a nonfactor. If he was still on the roster he would be the 6th best OFer.

--------------------------------------------------------------------


Sure. BUT Comparatively, it takes less talent than the other positions on the field. Its the least important among the positions, though I wouldnt call it unimportant.

I just think overall the defense at the position is over-rated. In fact, I feel that LF defense (at least at Fenway) and 3B are less important defensively. Obviously you can't stick a gargoyle at either because range is somewhat a factor. But a good fielding 1B can save a lot of runs by being able to stretch, flex, and catch everything that is thrown at him. Plus I believe fielding ground balls and short hoppers are harder than fly balls and line drives though sometimes 1B will have to try and field LD (obviously I’m referring to LFers on the last example).

I'll admit that i know very little about Kotsay, but if the guy's back is going to be questionable from here on out (say, if he pulls it or strains it), then what was the point of making the trade to begin with? I think we would be better served getting back a OF that's young, can hit, and can stash in AAA till we dump coco.

Rosters are expanding in like 12 seconds from now. We don't need to worry about stashing anyone at AAA. Aging free agent is a cheaper, easier acquisition than "young OF who can hit."

Having Brandon Moss would have been helpful here, but there's nothing to talk about there. Sox did what they had to do to move Manny and still get a good player back. They succeeded in that respect. And patching the "starting LF" hole was a more important concern than patching the 4th/5th OF hole.

I'm damn glad we have Kotsay to provide us some depth in the absence of JD Drew, and it's great that he can play a serviceable first base, but from all reports, Sean Casey was ready to play last night. Why, then, does Francona put Kotsay at 1st again? They're both lefties facing a righty in Kevin Millwood.... I know everything obviously worked out well and this isn't a huge deal, but if Casey's healthy and Youkilis isn't, he clearly should be at first base.